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Poll

Should we raise the Time to kill a bit?

  • Yes, combat are too short
    8 (36.4%)
  • No, combat are too long, we should lower it instead
    1 (4.5%)
  • No, time to kill is fine as it is
    13 (59.1%)
  • I don't mind either way
    0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 22

Voting closed: May 03, 2018, 01:07:37 pm

Topic: Increase TTK a bit? (Read 409 times) previous topic - next topic

Increase TTK a bit?
I know that a lot of people are fans of "fast combat" but, imho, the combat as it is now, it is a bit TOO fast.
There have been times (a lot of them) where i have been killed in matters of 5-6s
Ok, i would have still surely lost those same pvp because the one attacking me was clearly superior....but being able to kill someone in less than 10s is way too much imho.
In many occasion it is not the loss that is the big deal in itself (at least to me)....it is not even being able to have fun in the combat (because dying before being able to cast 2 spells is NOT fun).
I liked the combat way more 2 months ago when they lasted much longer due to the dmg outputs being much lower than we currently have.
Combats were more tactic, you had more time to make comebacks and to try different strategies.
When combat are over so fast, i find no fun in them at all

Just as an example of one of my last (horrible :D) deaths: i was wearing a mix bone/leather and was reached in melee range by a studded wearer with the usual 2h sword.....i didn't even have the time to cast a begone and i was already dead.
He was hitting me for 40+ dmg a hit (hitting more than once per second roughly) on the front and 60+ on the back....it took him 5-6 hits to kill me.

Imho melee dmg is way too high as it is now (especially when in medium armor that gives you even more melee dmg/spd).
At least with arrows/spells you need to charge, aim and shoot so it will take a little time between hits, and you can miss much more easily....when in melee range, it is usually over in matter of a mere few seconds because the dmg from a single hit is same/higher than that of an arrow/spell AND you hit much faster.
  • Last Edit: April 26, 2018, 01:09:53 pm by dariobrun

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #1
IMO, the problem mostly comes from how easy it is to get high damage weapons (R60), while it's not easy getting high protection armors (infernal, snowhide, dragon bone).
Wyverex Erisian, SG of Scrubs


Still a member of SaltyBitches™ Club

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #2
IMO, the problem mostly comes from how easy it is to get high damage weapons (R60), while it's not easy getting high protection armors (infernal, snowhide, dragon bone).
To me one of the main problem actually remains mostly melee dmg which is way too high per hit considering how fast you swing.
Range fights feels like more balanced in terms of TTK because there are much more misses, and you need roughly 1s to charge a shoot.
When you reach melee combat, on the other hand, it is 40+ dmg a hit in a fraction of a second with little chances to miss.
A good solution would be either lower melee dmg (for example remove the melee bonuses from medium armors? they feel like being a bit too good as they are now, compared to heavy armors for example, imho...and that's why you see a lot more medium wearer than heavy ones) or slow the swing speed.

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #3
I wouldn't mind the combat lastting a little longer.

That said, I don't really mind it now. But I understand your point, I myself have been in situations where it's all over in less than 10 seconds, and it would have taken me over an hour to even assemble the ready bag I lost (farm + assembly time).

So it's not hard to see there's an issue somewhere.

p.s your poll does not account for "Don't mind it either way" option...

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #4
dont stand in meele range trying to cast a begone.

simple.
I dueled him once and was in control first half of the fight and then food buff wore out and not noticing lost, so he did win but hes by no means any better a player than I.

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #5
Title is misleading. You do not want to increase overall TTK. You want to lower melee damage. Be precise next time please.

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #6
Title is misleading. You do not want to increase overall TTK. You want to lower melee damage. Be precise next time please.
Nope, i want to increase overall TTK and just said that i feel the problem is more prevalent in melee, which imho is currently the biggest part of the TTK issue (but i would like an overall TTK increase anyway).
I wouldn't mind the combat lastting a little longer.

That said, I don't really mind it now. But I understand your point, I myself have been in situations where it's all over in less than 10 seconds, and it would have taken me over an hour to even assemble the ready bag I lost (farm + assembly time).

So it's not hard to see there's an issue somewhere.

p.s your poll does not account for "Don't mind it either way" option...
Yeah you are right, forgot that possible option....i added it
  • Last Edit: April 26, 2018, 04:09:17 pm by dariobrun

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #7
dont stand in meele range trying to cast a begone.
That's not the issue? The issue being that, especially in melee combat, you die in less than 5 seconds since we can deal 50+ dps and we have less than 400hp.
That was just an example to show how little time is needed to kill someone with current damage

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #8
Well, you keep bringing melee examples. But you say it's a bout overall TTK being too short. Is time in which mage kills too short too?

  • gosti
  • [*][*][*][*][*]
Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #9
Imo TTK is fine, other than robe vs robe. (1v1 scenarios)

In bigger fights the only problem I see is too spammable field aoes.

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #10
Well, you keep bringing melee examples. But you say it's a bout overall TTK being too short. Is time in which mage kills too short too?
Well i had the same happening against mages, but just a pair of times....it is harder to tell when 90% of the people you face is melee/ranged.
As i said, i think the thing is more prevalent in melee combat, but this might be skewed due to having to face much less mages than melee/archers.
Btw, what i was trying to say is that i preferred the combat pace in the first month of the game when the protections from armor had much more impact on reducing the overall dps you could put out, both in melee and ranged combat.
I feel that the offensive powers of character goes up way more than the defensive one, thus making "low level" combat much funnier and tactical than "high end" combat due to that.
Probably they could solve it by increasing armor protections across the board for higher level armours so that you can bring the TTK more in line with what it was at the beginning when we had lower stats/no masteries and r20-30 weapons and were hitting each other for 20-30 dmg a hit instead of 40-60 a hit like we do now (with just 50-60hp more than what we had back then)

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #11
TTK feels too short mostly when facing a good melee pusher in leather, as it gives ranged AND melee attacks a boost in speed AND damage. Which is idiotic and should not be needed imo. Rest is fine, you will survive a long time even getting focused with good movement and blocking skills.

  • Last Edit: April 26, 2018, 09:57:05 pm by Asdrael

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #12
tldr: i want to be able to bhop away as mage every time i get low hp and never die just like in DF1

  • Nuyur
  • [*][*][*][*][*]
Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #13
You die in 5-6 seconds AFTER he got into melee range.
You should start the clock the moment you start your first offensive spell.

The longer it takes him to close the gap, the lower his stats are, the more likely you are to win the fight.
Melee dps is higher because it has a severe disatvantage in applyable range.

Now if you brought up team fights, that would be a different story.
As there's likely always 1 enemy not aware you are in their group.
But even then, how did you get in their group, how easy are you to focus (especially in leather gear).

Its unfair to compare ranged and melee in a dps race and say its too fast.
Just like its unfair to say mages have high dps, when you look at bolt+instant ray spam on a stationairy target.
The reality is, you dont have 100% accuracy...you cant always get/stay in melee range, and everybody has tools to avoid it for some time.

If your opponent is good enough to catch you out, lowering it by 20% would still result in you dieing in 6-8 hits.
It wont get TTK above 10 seconds, if we count it your way...

Re: Increase TTK a bit?
Reply #14
You forget, though, that the melee is shooting arrows at you while closing distance, so it is not that you are 100% and he is 50% when he reaches melee.

As i said, to my likings at least, it is not just the melee that does too much dmg, it is everything, compared to the proections we get from armors.
I preferred A LOT combats in the beginning when we had 300-350hp and were hitting each other for 15-20 dmg instead of what you get after developing characters, where you have now 400hp and hit for 40-50 dmg.
TTK is much higher at lower skill/stats level because the protection doesn't scale nearly as much as dmg does (you get dmg increases through stats, skills, mastery and better weapons; protections, on the contrary, only grow by few points based on your armor resulting, in the end, in the much lower TTK that i don't like)