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Re: village/upkeep
Reply #15
It's not unreasonable to ask for a system that spread villages out evenly over the timezones. Unlike now, where maybe 5% goes live around regular EU playing times.
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  • Nuyur
  • [*][*][*][*][*]
Re: village/upkeep
Reply #16
I understand that you think villages are end game content, but its not what ubergames is intending with them.
Never said anything like this nor suggested it. I don't think villages are end game content. What I said is they got connected with endgame content (which is conquest) by making them one of upkeep payment methods.
Also your "argument" of how people will place siege windows outside of their prime time is just your daydream. Could happen, don't have to. IMO it's highly unlikely.

What I'm saying is that local content in localized world should be available to local land owners. Designing the game in a way that allows this local content to be disabled for most of the time for local land owner is just bad. Especially if localization was their goal from the start.

Im glad you skipped right past the part where clans should be looking to recruit people from multiple time zones, instead of zerging it up in one and being deserted in another.
Now you want to say its bad. But suppose you had 10 russians, 10 germans, 10 new yorkers and 10 hawaiians binding to the same hamlet. With a dozen or so inbetweeners. There'd be activity round the clock. They'd have the potential to rebuild their watchtower network to prevent sieges by single time zone blobs. They'd have no real trouble to hold, at least fight, a village at any time of day.

Now you want to say thats unreasonable....at which point i refer you to my previous post in this thread and the ideal that ubergames is pursueing.
Multiply numbers by 3-5 for cities...now you might be getting it

*I know you cant bind. I mean living in the local area and not going all over the map for whatever action they can get

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #17
Im glad you skipped right past the part where clans should be looking to recruit people from multiple time zones, instead of zerging it up in one and being deserted in another.
Now you want to say its bad. But suppose you had 10 russians, 10 germans, 10 new yorkers and 10 hawaiians binding to the same hamlet. With a dozen or so inbetweeners. There'd be activity round the clock. They'd have the potential to rebuild their watchtower network to prevent sieges by single time zone blobs. They'd have no real trouble to hold, at least fight, a village at any time of day.
Yeah, I guess you're glad I skipped the multiple timezones clan part. As it makes zero sense. So you are against siege window mechanic? Or do you think that it's fine that with a siege windows introduced most members of this multiple timezone clan you've just imagined will never participate in a siege?

Game has already moved towards single timezone clans. With siege window introduction. Please think before you post. Thank you.
  • Last Edit: October 07, 2017, 11:51:44 pm by wildNothing

  • Nuyur
  • [*][*][*][*][*]
Re: village/upkeep
Reply #18
I do think multi timezone clans are great. Because the watchtowers, that need to get destroyed before you can siege, can be build up at any time of day. So if you are against a single time zone blob, that isnt online for the remaining 16-20 hours of that day.
It gives a TON of time to people who cannot attend the siege to contribute in the defense by making sure the siege is never even dropped!

Destroying watchtowers is time based, because there's intervals before you can progress to the next one.
Doesnt matter if you kill it slowly alone, or nearly instantly with a blob. The next tower cannot be taken untill x minutes have passed.
Have enough watchtowers, so 4 hours (which is honestly longer than i expect the average person to play for) does not reach your holding. Have the rest of the fucking day to rebuild watchtowers to keep a holding safe.

Now i understand rebuilding watchtowers isnt the most glorious means of defending a holding, nor the most interesting action maybe...But when it comes down to it, id feel more purpose in upkeeping a watchtower network than farming mats ill never get to use in a siege.

You may zerg everybody 4 hours a day in your time zone, but the remaining 20 hours, things are easily rebuild and managed. You'd be fighting an uphill battle, only to drop your progress at the end of each day. Thats why spreading is better, not to mention that living locally means you can only farm 10-15 mob spawns. Some of which may be trash. You wouldnt want to scale a spawn to 50+, rather do 15-20 spanning across the entire day.

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #19
I do think multi timezone clans are great. Because the watchtowers, that need to get destroyed before you can siege, can be build up at any time of day. So if you are against a single time zone blob, that isnt online for the remaining 16-20 hours of that day.
It gives a TON of time to people who cannot attend the siege to contribute in the defense by making sure the siege is never even dropped!

Destroying watchtowers is time based, because there's intervals before you can progress to the next one.
Doesnt matter if you kill it slowly alone, or nearly instantly with a blob. The next tower cannot be taken untill x minutes have passed.
Have enough watchtowers, so 4 hours (which is honestly longer than i expect the average person to play for) does not reach your holding. Have the rest of the fucking day to rebuild watchtowers to keep a holding safe.

Now i understand rebuilding watchtowers isnt the most glorious means of defending a holding, nor the most interesting action maybe...But when it comes down to it, id feel more purpose in upkeeping a watchtower network than farming mats ill never get to use in a siege.

You may zerg everybody 4 hours a day in your time zone, but the remaining 20 hours, things are easily rebuild and managed. You'd be fighting an uphill battle, only to drop your progress at the end of each day. Thats why spreading is better, not to mention that living locally means you can only farm 10-15 mob spawns. Some of which may be trash. You wouldnt want to scale a spawn to 50+, rather do 15-20 spanning across the entire day.

That is why good organized clans with a good leadership and dedicated casuals will  have a very good spot, if not the best assumptions in DnD (hi Lux <3).

If we get the gameplay (in pure fighting, buffs and damage) correct, which is a pain in the ass and my biggest fear for now, we will get the small pvp oriented crowd happy as well, but without the ability to mess up in moin what the long term clans build up over month.

Maybe DnD can survive without a good pvp approach, as a kind of pve server and it might be a good game, it just wouldnt be darkfall.

So far i see a lot of upcoming content, which will work out and good  new player experience (since the dev team can test it partly themselves --- sorry, couldnt resist ^^).

Remains to be seen, if the title system, wards and buffs and all that stuff (for any references how it should work, read Nuyurs posts, he knows best) works out and can entertain the pvp crowd (no, not only the few df vets .... pvp people are out there, besides df)

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #20
Nuyur and Heldana - please create your fantasy thread and spam it with your wall of text posts. GTFO from this one. You assumptions are based on outdated site. While I'm talking about apparent flaws of the game that we can witness, not some fantasy that you think will exist in the future.

You base your assumptions on what? Ub3rgame's descriptions of what watchtower system will be? Do you realize that in the same descriptions of game mechanics they still claim that holding's upkeep is paid in gold? Their site is misleading and sometimes simply false. They do not even care to update it. Stop considering what is there as a reliable source of knowledge about the game.

Also if you base your assumptions on their outdated site do not pick and choose parts of provided information. They stated it clear that THERE WILL BE INVULNERABILITY PERIOD APPLIED TO WATCHTOWERS MECHANIC TOO. There goes your multi timezone daydream - to the thrash, were it belongs. It's a shame though that you spammed this thread like crazy without a single valid thought on the topic.
  • Last Edit: October 08, 2017, 01:00:23 pm by wildNothing

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #21
So you post your wild ideas, which adds nothing to the game (i think, that is where your name comes from) in a gaming forum of a dev team, trying to push that through and against said dev team, meanwhile doubting their facts?

I dont even ......

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #22
So you post your wild ideas, which adds nothing to the game (i think, that is where your name comes from) in a gaming forum of a dev team, trying to push that through and against said dev team, meanwhile doubting their facts?

I dont even ......
Yeah, I'm doubting their "facts". And as they state there that upkeep is payed in gold I guess value of these "facts" is obvious to anyone that is playing the game and not just trolling on forums. They are worth shit.

  • Nuyur
  • [*][*][*][*][*]
Re: village/upkeep
Reply #23
It may be outdated, but they've shown to hold true to ideals...not the path leading to it.
So upkeep for holdings got changed from gold, which is historically a vastly unstable currency, and tied it to actual player activity.
Which is far better at upholding their ideal, while being another equalizer (or less of a gap) between what new and veteran players can achieve. You dont take a 1 day old newbie to farm the demon. You can take him to PvE quests, maps, keys, villages, chaos chests.
That newbie is going to come a lot closer in med points earned/hour than gold/hour.
I dont see how they've abandond their old idea, it simply got made better.

And yes, watchtowers will have invuln times just like sieges.
But i was talking about building up those towers, not tearing them down.
You can build towers 24/7, provided you have the materials and man power.
You cant destroy them 24/7, even if your blob was no-lifing the game.

So spreading timezone allows you a greater chance at finding time to (re)build watchtowers.
Which stops sieges from being dropped, which means just zerging it up in EU time doesnt mean a larger EU clan cant siege you.
However, if you mixed in a few NA you could rebuild watchtowers and the only EU clan cannot reach the walls to drop a siege because there's always more towers defending.

I know this is hard to grasp...so lets go to a more basic analogy.
We are playing (european) football. You want a team of only strikers, because they are the ones that score.
While im suggesting that having a few defenders, is sort of usefull for when the ball gets dropped and the attack needs to get rebuild from your half. Now ofcourse your strikers could go through the added effort of running across the entire field, basicly investing way more time and effort to get the job done. Which works in an actual football team because its a 90 min (plus extentions) match and they get paid to do it. But when you have a RL job, and friends and family, and you arent dedicating your life to a game...
Maybe having people who can do it in their normal play session isnt such a bad thing.

If this is still too hard to grasp, just ignore it then. The thread isnt really about this subject anyway, i was merely pointing out that villages can, should and perhaps will be contested across all time zones even in a localized world. And that holdings do not need to tie their timers down to a fixed window, because this creates peaks in activity and therefor low points aswell.
You'd be left without pvp content if you are EU surrounded by NA. Not something id want.
While a mix by everybody keeps the action going at all times, where the few purist get buttfucked whenever they go on the offense because their progress is easily negated in their off hours in an hour or two

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #24
It may be outdated, but they've shown to hold true to ideals...not the path leading to it.
So upkeep for holdings got changed from gold, which is historically a vastly unstable currency, and tied it to actual player activity.
Which is far better at upholding their ideal, while being another equalizer (or less of a gap) between what new and veteran players can achieve. You dont take a 1 day old newbie to farm the demon. You can take him to PvE quests, maps, keys, villages, chaos chests.
That newbie is going to come a lot closer in med points earned/hour than gold/hour.
I dont see how they've abandond their old idea, it simply got made better.

And yes, watchtowers will have invuln times just like sieges.
But i was talking about building up those towers, not tearing them down.
You can build towers 24/7, provided you have the materials and man power.
You cant destroy them 24/7, even if your blob was no-lifing the game.

So spreading timezone allows you a greater chance at finding time to (re)build watchtowers.
Which stops sieges from being dropped, which means just zerging it up in EU time doesnt mean a larger EU clan cant siege you.
However, if you mixed in a few NA you could rebuild watchtowers and the only EU clan cannot reach the walls to drop a siege because there's always more towers defending.

I know this is hard to grasp...so lets go to a more basic analogy.
We are playing (european) football. You want a team of only strikers, because they are the ones that score.
While im suggesting that having a few defenders, is sort of usefull for when the ball gets dropped and the attack needs to get rebuild from your half. Now ofcourse your strikers could go through the added effort of running across the entire field, basicly investing way more time and effort to get the job done. Which works in an actual football team because its a 90 min (plus extentions) match and they get paid to do it. But when you have a RL job, and friends and family, and you arent dedicating your life to a game...
Maybe having people who can do it in their normal play session isnt such a bad thing.

If this is still too hard to grasp, just ignore it then. The thread isnt really about this subject anyway, i was merely pointing out that villages can, should and perhaps will be contested across all time zones even in a localized world. And that holdings do not need to tie their timers down to a fixed window, because this creates peaks in activity and therefor low points aswell.
You'd be left without pvp content if you are EU surrounded by NA. Not something id want.
While a mix by everybody keeps the action going at all times, where the few purist get buttfucked whenever they go on the offense because their progress is easily negated in their off hours in an hour or two
Sorry, I'm not going to read this.

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #25
Because it's a single set of paragraphs that contains better thought out information than any of the text you've posted in this thread?

Just a thought.

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #26
Because it's a single set of paragraphs that contains better thought out information than any of the text you've posted in this thread?

Just a thought.

It might be an allergic reaction to facts and reasonable argueing though ...

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #27
bump for best suggestion. OP for president.

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #28
Still best suggestion regarding village timers. @Ub3rgames ??

Re: village/upkeep
Reply #29
I don't think this is the "best suggestion."

The fixed 25 hours timer we have now is way more dynamic and allows everyone to participate on an even scale and does not favor one particular region over others. It favors and disfavors everyone at the same rate.
One group who got favored by a village for a week, will be disfavored by the same village next week and vice versa.

Your suggestion would statically always only favor one group and disfavor others, unless the holding gets sieged and changes ownership from NA to EU or vice versa. Yes, you could say that this adds value to a holding, because it has many villages connected.

However, it doesn't feel "right" or like an "organic" solution. It will create permanent imbalances, especially for specific remote regions.

For instance on Niffleheim, Angfrost would be linked to three villages, Frostcoast to one and all the other holdings to none.
Hypothetically, if Angfrost is owned by a NA clan and the other holdings by EU and / or RU clans, there is very little chance for the EU / RU clans to capture any of the villages at any comfortable time because they will always be live at off hours for EU / RU. While the clan of Angfrost would have an easy time capturing them over and over and over again without much resistance.
Same scenario for Ul'Sulak on Ruby.

This is just an extreme example. But it would be similar to other villages all over the world, especially for remote regions. Some villages would never be captureable for players from a different timezone. Especially if they have holdings with no villages connected.
And it also creates problems for players from the same timezone. Like if you have multiple villages in a region go live at the same time, every clan captures its village and then go home, because there is no point riding to the other village, because it most likely will be captured at the same time. Etc.